Generell Info

[King of Queens]

Hi guys,
First of all, I have to apologize for writing in English.
I had some German in College, but do not like to bother you with my crappy German.


I am newbie here in this particular forum and need some questions answered to better understand the Joker family.

Could someone explain to me in a short and understandable manner the different Joker3 versions.
I am particularly interested in the 3DD version.
I downloaded all the manuals but it is still confusing.
HELP PLEASE

If you would rather answer in German, that's o.k., my wife is fluent in German and could translate it for me.

BR
Skip

[Jhannes]

AW: Generell Info

Hi skip!

Nice to get some international members at this "german" site.

I will try it in english .

The biggest difference is, that the "normal" Joker 3 has 1 Motor for the mainrotor & the tailrotor together. (gear between the main- & tailrotor)

The "DD" means Dualdrive, so the "DD" version has 2 independent motors & accu packs for the mainrotor & the tailrotor.
(Fully Aerobatic Electrical Helicopters using 12s Lipo packs for the mainrotor and 4s Lipo-Packs for the tailrotor ....)

excerpt from the minicopter homepage:
Concept
After more than one year of development and testing minicopter is introducing with the Joker 3 DD ("DualDrive") a radical new design in 90 size 3D helicopters. Based on the security limitation that not more than 12 cells should be connected in series to avoid voltages higher than 50 Volts the basic idea to get more power output is to separate mainrotor from tailrotor mechanically to drive higher pitch angles and deflections. The concept is a completely separation of mainrotor and tailrotor and drive each rotor with a fully independent electric drive system, that means motor, controller and battery are absolutely stand alone for each rotor. So there is no mechanical power lost from the taildrive gear system. In practise the power for the mainrotor will increased for more than 20 percent and in combination with the flybarless head there are about 35 percent more power output than a comparable Joker 2 with MFS rotorhead.

BR
Hannes

[Rüdi]

AW: Generell Info

Hi Hannes,
was kommt denn für das Heck als Motor in Frage?

Hast du schon eingekauft oder stellst noch zusammen?

Gruß
Rüdiger

[King of Queens]

AW: Generell Info

Hi skip!

Nice to get some international members at this "german" site.

I will try it in english .

The biggest difference is, that the "normal" Joker 3 has 1 Motor for the mainrotor & the tailrotor together. (gear between the main- & tailrotor)

The "DD" means Dualdrive, so the "DD" version has 2 independent motors & accu packs for the mainrotor & the tailrotor.
(Fully Aerobatic Electrical Helicopters using 12s Lipo packs for the mainrotor and 4s Lipo-Packs for the tailrotor ....)

excerpt from the minicopter homepage:
Concept
After more than one year of development and testing minicopter is introducing with the Joker 3 DD ("DualDrive") a radical new design in 90 size 3D helicopters. Based on the security limitation that not more than 12 cells should be connected in series to avoid voltages higher than 50 Volts the basic idea to get more power output is to separate mainrotor from tailrotor mechanically to drive higher pitch angles and deflections. The concept is a completely separation of mainrotor and tailrotor and drive each rotor with a fully independent electric drive system, that means motor, controller and battery are absolutely stand alone for each rotor. So there is no mechanical power lost from the taildrive gear system. In practise the power for the mainrotor will increased for more than 20 percent and in combination with the flybarless head there are about 35 percent more power output than a comparable Joker 2 with MFS rotorhead.

BR
Hannes

Hi Hannes.
thanks a lot for the info and your help.

I am more interested in the 3DD version.
I downloaded various manuals and am still a bit confused. . .

There are two different main drive systems. One where the motor drives the main gear through a belt and another one where the motor is directly geared to the main gear.
Also for the tail drive system I can see one version where the motor drives the torque tube directly and another version, where the motor drives a belt for the tail rotor.
Can you mix those versions or are some just older variants and not available any more?

I also saw different linkages from the servos to the swash plate.
Are these options which you are able to order at your liking?

On other thing. I was not able to find a textural accompaniment to the manuals.
The graphics are excellent, but I'd like to see sometimes some more explanation. . .

Sorry for all the questions. I am just trying to understand which options are available and make a good fit.

Thanks again for your help and everybody else who might jump in here.

BR
Skip

[Gerd Guzicki]

AW: Generell Info

Generally there are three basic versions of the Dualdrive systems available.

The single stage version Joker 3DD was made as a quiet and powerful gear drive. But it has the disadvantage that the motor, caused from the big main gear wheel, must be placed in the center area of the battery tray. So the battery is different to all former minicopter designs and you need two separate 6s packs. You can modify the CG changing the tailmotor battery with one of the mainmotor batteries.

We have got this year a lot of orders for the Joker 3 / Maxi-Joker 3 where we must still work on until end of this year. So at present it is not possible to produce two relative different mechanics and production of the single stage DD will be continued first next year. And after the first innovation shock last year that I have expected the number of orders of DualDrive models has increased continuously during the last six months. The people see that the system works reliable and also they recognize besides the longer life time of the batteries especially the benefit in certain areas like heavy-lifters, Fenestrons, Notars, where a single drive is more comlicate or simply overloaded.
So I had to look for a solution for these customers and I mixed a Joker 3 with the Joker 3DD and so the Joker 3+DD was born. The main advantage of this system is the possibility to change between single and Dualdrive now only ordering some specific new parts. Also the typical long battery tray of the Joker is the same now as always.

Last but not least there is a special version available for camera pilots using a front gimbal. The tailmotor is placed here directly at the tail, the motor shaft is at the same time the tailrotor shaft. Plettenberg has made a special motor for us for this use, the motor shaft is not more expensive than a normal tailrotor shaft and fast to replace. Let us call this version Joker 3DDD (Direct DualDrive), but is is only for interest for front gimbal machines to correct the CG and as dynamic balance weight using its inertia (and of course to simplyfy the mechanic to an absolute minimum).

Swash linkage is now on all of our machines only direct, with PP linkage there were some shaking problems with some flybarless systems that we could not solve.

The Joker 3 is available either with TT or belt drive, 90% are ordering the TT drive.

On the Joker 3DD with belt driven tailrotor there were some problems caused from the quality of the tail motor bearings, so we have discontinued this type.

The text in english manuals is just at work, a professional photographer prepares a photo show filled with a lot of hints, first only for Joker 3 / Maxi-Joker 3. Dualdrive models will come later. As long I am the built instructor (as far as necessary).

When you will see a DDD model in action look here:

Photo-Maxi-Joker DDD in Action 1

Photo-Maxi-Joker DDD in Action 2


*** Auf Wunsch von Gerd rausgenommen ***